766: Decisive

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Wackd
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Joined: Wed Jan 25, 2012 5:20 pm

766: Decisive

Post by Wackd »

And, of course, there's another layer that this is a communal fiction, with its participants having differing opinions and differing amounts of information about the characters they're playing. And there's the other other layer of differing versions of Scooby-Doo itself - original Freddy is a different character from Mystery Incorporated Freddy, who is a different character from live-action Freddy as portrayed by Freddie Prinze Jr.
The point of Mystery Incorporated Freddy, honestly, is that he's not a different character from "original" Freddy. And that, when contrasted against a well-rounded cast of individuals with desires outside of mystery hunting, Freddy as a person doesn't make much sense--the same way Scooby-Doo, as a franchise, increasingly appears deficient the more competent its contemporaries become.

Like, guys, this was airing on the same network as Adventure Time. Deep and vibrant and filled to the brim with emotional depth. Scooby-Doo is traditionally not capable of any of these things, and so Mystery Inc. internalizes all that into Freddy. (And let's be honest, doing so isn't really displacing any sort of established persona for Freddy the same way it would be for the rest of the cast.) Freddy cannot express emotion because he feels it devalues him somehow. Freddy cannot focus on anything beyond mysteries because it frankly wouldn't occur to him. Fred cannot notice that his friends are deeper people because he is a living, breathing metaphor for the things people expect of Scooby-Doo.

Don't get me wrong--Freddy grows and evolves over the course of the series, because he exists in an environment that allows that and thus is proof that the franchise doesn't have to embody those flaws. But he's starting from a base setting of basically just being Fred from Where Are You?.
RM-Ciro
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Re: 766: Decisive

Post by RM-Ciro »

First thing I have to say, I love Jamie´s pose in the last panel. It´s just so very fitting.
The art overall in this arc is good, with the lighting and all that.Having reread the first couple strips recently, the improvements are quite enormous.

Also,this arc sparked my interest in Scooby-Doo for the first time in,like, 20 years. As a result, I have watched the first 10 Episodes of Mystery Inc.,and Freddy was just...thick,in my opinion. His dedication was admirable, but he was very one-noted. If he really is the bundled-up expectation how this show would be received, it explains not only his character, but my lack of interest in the franchise for the last two decades as well.

And am I the only one who has a problem with the statement that an interpretation of a fictional character can be objectively wrong? Perception of any given character and their behavior is,ultimately always subjective.Freddy,Max, and her interpretation of him are quite fine examples here.
Salivanth
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Re: 766: Decisive

Post by Salivanth »

Anyone else notice that Jamie said "dominance-hump the ever-loving shit out of her" instead of "out of him"? I don't think Ellen's going to be happy with that particular choice (or slip) of wording...
Tem
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Re: 766: Decisive

Post by Tem »

Max is talking a bit of nonsense her. Maybe Max is non-threatening. But is Freddy? And does Freddy intend to bottom for Daphne? And if so, how is this an intrinsic character trait of Freddy that Daphne should have known?

Besides, her reasoning that no one is right to be scared because she wants to give them something, is faulty. If someone wants to give you syphilis, you are supposed to run in the other direction. Also, not everything that is pleasant is good. Hopefully Max would not insist on offering a diabetic person cake, even when they tell her they can't eat it.
aryashi
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Re: 766: Decisive

Post by aryashi »

Also,this arc sparked my interest in Scooby-Doo for the first time in,like, 20 years. As a result, I have watched the first 10 Episodes of Mystery Inc.,and Freddy was just...thick,in my opinion. His dedication was admirable, but he was very one-noted. If he really is the bundled-up expectation how this show would be received, it explains not only his character, but my lack of interest in the franchise for the last two decades as well.
The big thing with Mystery Inc is that is builds, and slowly. Fred starts with the baseline of being Trap obsessed and oblivious (more so than Where Are You Fred ever was imho) and then things... happen. His casual mentions of cutting off his emotions and his Dad the mayor's total non-relationship with him get thrown into a larger context that really kick starts the emotional arc of the show.

And then the PLOT really kicks in... Mr. E is really just the beginning, it bananas how deep the rabbit hole goes.
Arklytte
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Re: 766: Decisive

Post by Arklytte »

Salivanth wrote:Anyone else notice that Jamie said "dominance-hump the ever-loving shit out of her" instead of "out of him"? I don't think Ellen's going to be happy with that particular choice (or slip) of wording...
'Going to be'? Did you see her irritated look in the last two panels? Or the fact that she *immediately* fired off a DM Fiat/Bang your Dead (or Caught, in this case) the instant 'Scooby and Freddy' headed out of the room? Yeah, I'd say Ellen's way past (not) happy at this point. :)
Tem
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Re: 766: Decisive

Post by Tem »

Arklytte wrote:
Salivanth wrote:Anyone else notice that Jamie said "dominance-hump the ever-loving shit out of her" instead of "out of him"? I don't think Ellen's going to be happy with that particular choice (or slip) of wording...
'Going to be'? Did you see her irritated look in the last two panels? Or the fact that she *immediately* fired off a DM Fiat/Bang your Dead (or Caught, in this case) the instant 'Scooby and Freddy' headed out of the room? Yeah, I'd say Ellen's way past (not) happy at this point. :)
The slip of wording is Max' fault, she has been ranting about how she is so nice and non-threatening all while justifying her actions in-character.

Jamie is getting into his role way too much. He's trying to realistically depict a talking dog, and talking animals who actually act like animals are creepy. (I mean, imagine him sniffing a female characters behind) It's a typical Jamie thing to do and will end up making him look like a creep.

What Ellen did was a very good move. I have been in some D&D groups where the DM did not intervene in such situations, and the end result was the dissolving of said group. Being attacked while going outside to do the naughty is a typical horror trope, so she's well within her rights to use it. And it has the added benefit of stopping the both of them from further pissing off Lily and creeping out Gina.
If I were DMing for Max, I would set a rule of "No sex will be mentioned, implied, or roleplayed, ever." ...but then, Max would likely trying to argue with me, so just doing the DM Fiat whenever she gets out of control is likely the wiser thing to do.
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Merle
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Re: 766: Decisive

Post by Merle »

Tem wrote:Jamie is getting into his role way too much. He's trying to realistically depict a talking dog, and talking animals who actually act like animals are creepy. (I mean, imagine him sniffing a female characters behind) It's a typical Jamie thing to do and will end up making him look like a creep.
Not to mention, he's currently horny as hell and the whole question of his relationship with his roommate is up in the air. Hardly the best state of mind for rational thought.
What Ellen did was a very good move. I have been in some D&D groups where the DM did not intervene in such situations, and the end result was the dissolving of said group. Being attacked while going outside to do the naughty is a typical horror trope, so she's well within her rights to use it. And it has the added benefit of stopping the both of them from further pissing off Lily and creeping out Gina.
If I were DMing for Max, I would set a rule of "No sex will be mentioned, implied, or roleplayed, ever." ...but then, Max would likely trying to argue with me, so just doing the DM Fiat whenever she gets out of control is likely the wiser thing to do.
Agreed!
Neither a creeper nor a jackass be; if you manage these two things, everything else should work itself out.
yomikoma
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Re: 766: Decisive

Post by yomikoma »

As the Teenagers From Outer Space rulebook explained, "Sex isn't funny. Frustration... now THAT'S funny."
chaotic-nipple
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Re: 766: Decisive

Post by chaotic-nipple »

No, Max, you are NOT "bottoming". You are "topping from the bottom", which is a distinction that you of all people at this table should be able to grasp.
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